Episode 30: Kulap Vilaysack

[zach_coty]

This was a really good episode. I'm a big fan of Who Charted? and it was nice to hear Kulap open up so much about her life. I didn't personally have nearly as crazy a childhood as she did, but my father and his parents immigrated here and her story helped me understand my dad's stories and his parents stories a little better.

I think we can all identify at least a little with Kulap's story even though I grew up very differently. I'm currently near the end of the episode and the inner conflicts she's describing are the exact same things I've dealt with/deal with now.

Thanks again Paul for doing the podcast, and thanks Kulap for sharing with us.

[zach_coty]

Also, Paul, this is a bit off topic of the episode, but if you can release the episode where you went to far with the guest, I'd really like to hear it. I personally have a huge fear of embarrassment, and I feel it for other people (my friends, roommates, family, even girlfriend make me feel embarrassed), and I think hearing you talk through an embarrassing event might be helpful to hear.

I completely understand if you can't, especially if the guest doesn't want you to post it. You are putting yourself out in the open and dealing with very difficult subjects, I'm amazed that you've been able to do 30 episodes without really stepping on too many toes. I don't think any of us will think less of you for having an awkward joke in an interview or whatever.

Either way, thanks for everything dude.

[manuel_moe_g]

I agree with zach_coty.

It would be nice for Paul to release an episode without a guest, maybe do it regularly, and dig in deep on embarrassing awkward recent events, recent gripping fears, recent realizations of faults, etc. We all appreciate Paul's honesty, and it helps us greatly.

[Paul Gilmartin]

I was really happy to get Kulap on as a guest. Grey DeLisle told me she would be great (they're good friends) and she was right.

Not sure I'll ever release the interview where I upset the guest, because she requested so much cut out of it there wouldn't be much left. But as I'm accumulating a backlog of unaired interviews, I may start doing combination interviews, with multiple guests on one episode, cutting back and forth and having some kind of theme.

Paul

[dare i say it]

Great interview. My thanks to Paul and Kulap for being so courageous and open. Listening to this show is an emotional journey, which in itself is a challenge for me, but I always come away from it feeling inspired.

At about the 1 hour mark of the show, Kulap talks about not wanting to be an angry person because as a child her mom would get angry and say super hurtful things to her. Then there is some discussion of what it would be like if she (Kulap) had "permission" to get mad--if there were no consequences for her just letting it all out in any way that felt natural. It was absolutely poignant and riveting! Paul mentioned a friend of his who went to the desert (supervised?) and took out some anger on a mannequin with a baseball bat. You might have to listen to the episode for that to make sense.

I have so many questions for anyone who's willing to tell me what they think. First, are there other people out there like me who try to never get angry, or at least never show it? Are there other guys out there like me who hate crying, even in private, so they try to never do it? I feel like I was absent from school the day they taught how to deal with unpleasant emotions.

Hypothetical scenario: I'm pissed at my roommate because he never takes care of his dirty dishes and he has a few other annoying habits. I'm too accommodating or too afraid of how it might come out to tell him in any clear way though. Maybe I undersell the importance of my own wishes, or maybe I'm just comfortable in the role of "the nice guy." Maybe I have a strong need to be liked by everyone, or maybe I don't want to turn into my father. I bite my tongue. Still, there's this urge building in me to scream at the guy or punch him in the face. I don't do either of those things. On some level I know that punching someone is an inappropriate response for whatever he did, and I've never hit anyone so I'd probably break my hand or something, but at this point I am genuinely furious and indignant.

That was many years ago. Nothing ever really came of it. It's a relatively benign example of something that has come up in my life over and over again where I try to avoid feeling angry, or sad, or hurt, or lonely or basically anything unpleasant. Any thoughts? Similar experiences? I 'd love to hear from ya.

-Dan

[manuel_moe_g]

dare_i_say_it/Dan

It is possible to be too quick to manifest anger. You hope it leads to catharsis and gets the frustration out and leaves you in a more capable state to love yourself, but a lot of times yelling and punching just leads to more yelling and punching which leads to a lot of yelling and punching, and no progress is made.

The thing is doing what is actually best to leave you in a more capable state to handle life and make progress. Might be yelling, might be self-control. Do you feel like your progress is blocked by your habitual ways of dealing with frustrating situations.

Myself, I am working on allowing myself to be humbled, and being humbled, and learning from that. As opposed to lashing out.

[CallSignKay]

I don't know if it's a conscious decision never to get angry, or just that I don't feel comfortable sharing my emotions with other people. It's much easier to keep up a well-adjusted facade than to allow that vulnerability. I never want to make people mad, maybe because I grew up with a father who went from zero to furious in less than 60 seconds and it was just easier to say nothing than be honest about anything. But I think you have to value yourself enough to say your opinions are valid, your feelings are valid, and other people should respect that. If for no other reason than common courtesy and human decency. Confrontation sucks, I try to avoid it at all costs, but in that scenario your roommate is a fully functioning adult who should be able to do their own dishes. If you requested help with the cleaning, honestly and without judgment, then he should have respected you enough to put some effort into maintaining a happy and healthy household/relationship.

[dare i say it]

Wow, you guys are good. I mean that sincerely. Manuel_moe_g, I do think it holds back my progress that I'm carrying around a lot of strong emotions and trying to ignore them. Once in a great while, I'll allow myself to cry in private, or I'll use my anger to push myself to run a little farther. I guess I would have to admit that it usually feels cathartic after I do things like that. CallSighKay, trying to "keep up a well-adjusted facade" is a great way to describe something I do too. I think there's a big mismatch between how most people see me and how I actually feel inside.

Just to clarify, there is zero chance I ever would have actually hit my roommate. I don't really lose my temper, but I do need practice speaking my mind before something really gets under my skin and before I blow it out of proportion in my head. I moved out years ago. He had a tendency to be a little small-minded and pushy--not really my type of guy. I wish I had said something early on like, "Hey, Kevin, we're out of clean dishes. I need you to wash some of the ones you left in the sink." If I could have kept the frustration and judgment out of the tone of my voice (as you suggested), he might have actually done it. Maybe not. Either way I think I could have spared myself the burden of harboring all that resentment if I had spoken up sooner.

Dan

[Paul Gilmartin]

Dare I Say It,

It's amazing what we can communicate to other people in a respectful way. But it takes practice. I'm learning how to do it. I've found that by saying something like, "I"m feeling really frustrated because of this" or even "I don't know how to say this, because I don't want to start a fight or hurt your feelings, but I'm feeling a lot of anger about this situation..."

Hopefully you can also see that you are worth sticking up for.

Paul

[dare i say it]

Paul, thanks for the advice. Like you said, it will take practice, but those do sound like things I could say. --Dan